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tv   Book TV  CSPAN2  November 10, 2013 1:05am-1:16am EST

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the second thing is it was an excessive kind of puzzle even from the beginning when i started the story about rendition. i could not believe that people were being snatched off the streets in europe and elsewhere in the world by our own government officials wearing black hoods and putting these people on to a sleek white gulfstream jet and taking them to dungeon someplace where they
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would be no lawyer, no due process, no charges and potentially where they could be tortured forever and some of them died. it was just the most un-american thing i have ever heard of. i'd absolutely couldn't believe it was for real when i started out on this. the more i learned the more i realized it was a worldwide puzzle and there were reporters piecing little bits of it together which made it incredibly interesting.
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>> it all we ever had to go on and what has been accepted was what manson himself wants to tell people. illegitimate son of a teenage prostitute mother who cared so little about her child that she once tried to sell him for a pitcher of beer, how is a child he was abused by the uncles she would have moved into their home one after another. when he was nine or 10 she was so tired of having even tried to perfunctorily take care of him that she threw him into the juvenile justice system where he suffered greatly and from there his life turned bad. he didn't know who his father was. he didn't think his mother knew who his father was so he said he finally learned even as a child that the street was his father
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and prison was his mother. that is what everybody pretty much accepted. i decided to check it out so the first part is let's look at the man's whole life. how did he get there? the second question, where was he in and what kind of things were happening in our culture that made it possible for a charles manson to recruit a few dozen followers who would do these kinds of god awful things? again history doesn't happen in a vacuum. i'm i am kind of convinced that if charles manson had been paroled from prison in nebraska and ended up in omaha instead of los angeles when he tried these things he would have been impaled on a pitchfork and stuck up in the field as a scarecrow. he was in the right places at the right time. how did that happen? what i thought i would do, because you folks tonight, you have heard over and over during
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the years people's different versions of what happened on the ninth of august 9 and 10th, 1969. i will tell you there's new material in my book because in the course of my interviewing quite a few people including especially patricia carmichael who was involved in both nights and a couple of sound bites on the 25th in her fishery of the murders. she is never given a full account of it. she explained it all in such depth with such honesty and with such clarity that she ended up answering the final couple of questions that the lapd had about the murders all these years so yes there are some new things. most of all if it's okay with you i would like to talk very briefly about four parts of this book, charles manson, his life in the world he grew up in. let's begin with this childhood.
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we talked a minute ago about all the things manson claims. guess what? they are all lies and it's all documentable. i put 21,000 miles on my car in the last couple of years and i went everyplace he went. a lot of the lies can be proven in the simple visits to the county courthouses. charles charles manson was not illegitimate. his mother kathleen when she was 15, was unhappy with her fundamentalist christian mother nancy, who believe that girls should not cut their hair, should not do that terribly sinful thing that led to every evil in the world and that of course is dancing. we know now kathleen's side of the story for the first time because charles manson's sister, nancy, ever before interviewed anywhere and i found her and she
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told her mother's side of the story for the first time. she gave the dates and places that i could try to look. so here is what happened and this is what everybody in the family knew, the real manson family, including charles himself. when she is 15 kathleen maddox living in kentucky, crosses the bridge over the river to a town called ironton. she sneaks out of the house and goes to ironton because there are clubs there where people can dance. at one of these clubs ritzy raise is the name of that, she needs and exciting older man, 29 years old. his name is colonel scott. colonel is his given name, not a military rank. the colonel doesn't mind letting the 15-year-old girl think he is a war hero. of course he actually works in a factory, is married and has two
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children. that's the part he leaves out. not long later, kathleen becomes pregnant. she is 15. and she tells colonel scott. the colonel announces that he is going to do the right thing for her but he has just been called away by the army. he is going to come back in just a couple of weeks and they will take care of everything. and so kathleen goes to her mother and says she's pregnant. the father is going to marry her you can imagine her mother's reaction that nancy really does love kathleen so she says she will stick with her. they will all get through this. it's not the child's fault and colonel scott never calls again. kathleen is furious. there is another fellow in kathleen's life who would like
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to get her attention. his name is william manson. he is a common laborer whose dream is to be a dry cleaner. and no playing kathleen is pregnant with another man's child he marries her about five months before the birth. there was never any question that charles manson was an illegitimate av. his first certificate was filed a few days after -- a few weeks after his birth. william manson as his father but the whole family and charles himself knew throughout that the real father was colonel scott. no doubt whatsoever. so the later rumors that manson hated and feared blacks because he had a black father for instance never folks, never ever. manson in kathleen's marriage lasts a couple of years and he divorces her. she is still young girl and she's trying to run around and have a little fun.
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heard son is never left with strangers. instead she does what many young women that age do and sticks him with her mother or her sister glenna anglin's husband and daughter but he is cared for always. kathleen and her brother luther spectacularly botched an attempted rivalry. they tried to use a ketchup bottle poking someone's back saying it's a gun. the newspapers have a great time calling them the idiot ketchup waddled bandits at biggest dunderheads who ever committed a crime in kathleen gets five years in prison in west virginia and luther gets 10. yes that's on kathleen's record. never once anywhere before then or in the next 15 years was there any record she was arrested for prostitution, never warned about being a prostitute.
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she bungled the crime and she never should have tried to commit that charles manson was never this fun of a prostitute. not then, not ever. he goes to live in mecca in west west virginia, a little factory town with his uncle bill and lana and cousin jo ann who was three years older. i found jo ann who has never talked before and if any of you get a chance to look in the book tonight you will see that the photo section includes pictures of charles manson from his baby pictures to his wedding album. those came from jo ann and his sister nancy. they tell the real story. here's an interesting one jo ann told me about charlie. she said, from the time he came to live with him at five years old he is scary. he is violent and he lies about everything. the first person he ever we attacked was jo ann. he picked up the cycle in the
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